How do the Raptor axles compare to Dana 60s?

[BigJ]

I guy asked me this today, and it kinda stumped me. I mean, I know the general specs:

They both run a 9-3/4" ring gears... both can and do run 4.10:1 gears... I'm pretty sure OEM Dana's came with 32 or 35 spline shafts and the Raptor's rear comes with 34 splines...

So by the numbers the Ford Sterling our Raptors come with would seem to be comparable with a Dana 60. And obviously the front is a different ballgame all together (the Raptor being independent)

But what this guy was basically asking was are the Raptor's axles as "strong" as a Dana 60? Can they take the same punishment? I didn't know how to answer.

What do ya think?

 

[The Tank]

FFS will probably recognize this truck but I believe these pics were taken before it went to a built 9in. A good amount of L owners never touch the rear end while others throw some gear and an Eaton Tru-trac at it and thats it.

 

[MagicMtnDan]

From Wikipedia:

Dana 60 Front Axle

History
Ford was the first company to use Dana 60 front axles in 1955. In the mid 1970's the Big Three (automobile manufacturers) all started using this axle. GM began phasing it out in 1988 in favor of Independent suspension, while still offering it in some higher GVWR trucks (V-30) until 1991. Dodge used a Dana 60 up to 2002. 3rd Generation Dodge Rams dropped the Dana 60 in favor of a lighter, reverse cut AAM axle. Ford still uses the Dana 60 front axle. Manufactured in both Kingpin and Ball joint variations, "standard" and "reverse cut" rotation variations and open and limited slip variations. The housing material is Gray iron in early axles and Ductile iron in later axles. GM and Ford Dana 60 axles utilize locking hubs. Dodge Dana 60 axles utilized locking hubs until 1994 when a Center Axle Disconnect (CAD) system was adopted. However model year 2002 Rams phased out the CAD system leaving some 2002 Dana 60 axles permanently locked in.

Big Three variations
GM / Chevy versions are passenger side differential drop, standard rotation gears, kingpin knuckles and 35 Spline axle shafts.
Dodge versions were passenger side differential drop, standard rotation gears, kingpin knuckles and 35 spline axle shafts in early models. The 2nd Generation axles were drivers side with ball joints. 30 Spline axle shafts were used instead of 35 splines, except 2000, 2001 and 2002 models which were equipped with 32 spline axle shafts.

Ford versions are drivers side differential drop, reverse-cut gears, and kingpin knuckles up to 1991. The later axles have ball joints. Ford Dana 60 axles mostly feature 35 spline axle shafts.

Dana 60 aftermarket

The Dana 60 front axle has a great deal of aftermarket/third-party support, including many upgrades. Stronger axle shafts, Universal Joints and ball joints are widely available. As well as a large selection of traction control devices such as Locking differentials and Limited slip differentials. Axle shafts, Universal joints and carriers made from chromoly steel are even available. High capacity differential covers are available that increase the amount of oil the differential holds. These covers also feature Heat sinks that help keep the axle cool.

Dana Super 60

The Dana Super 60 is an upgraded version of the Dana 60 front axle.

Differences in the Dana Super 60 versus the regular Dana 60:
Larger and thicker diameter steel tubes (3.75 inches diameter and 1/2 in thick)
Larger ring and pinion which increase the contact area and overall strength.
Larger Universal Joints which increase strength and steering angle.
Super 60s use 1550 Universal Joints.
Net formed spider gears for increased strength.
All made with 35 Spline axle shafts.

Dana 60 Rear Axle

The Dana 60 rear axle was first introduced in 1955 as a full floating axle in Ford F-250's and is still used today.
Manufactured in both full float and semi float variations. The semi float axles were often rated up to 5,500 lbs and the full float axles were rated up to 6,500 lbs.
Full floating, 30 Spline, variants are common. 33 Spline semi floating, 35 Spline semi-floating and full floating axles exist, but are less common.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dana_60

 

[frogslinger]

Correct me if I am wrong but the raptor does not run the same rear end as the normal F150 (which I think the lightning runs)... it is a spec version from different suppliers based on the lobo version...

again I could be wrong.

 

[The Tank]

Correct me if I am wrong but the raptor does not run the same rear end as the normal F150 (which I think the lightning runs)... it is a spec version from different suppliers based on the lobo version...

again I could be wrong.

Lightnings got 4R100 trans sourced from the 7.3PSD and a Sterling 9.75 rear end. All F-150s got the 4R70W trans and a Ford 8.8. IIRC certain options IE FX4, max payload or towing would get a 31 spline 8.8 vs a 28 spline 8.8. I believe the Sterling 9.75 was first offered in the Light Duty F-250. Most common drivetrain failures in Lightnings are transmissions from going in to OD at WOT and 99-00 driveshafts because they are 3.5in steel vs 5in aluminum that comes in 01-04. Raptors will never be able to produce the same type of force a 600+tq roughly 4000lb truck (accounting for different levels of weight reduction) on a 28in tall slick on a prep'd drag strip.

 

[FordFanStan]

Yeah I believe same rear-end as the 99-04 Lightnings, 04 Heritage F-150's, several HD models, (I think 1997 F-250 Light Duty's), and probably a couple others too.

There are hardly any axles failures that I have known about in the L community. The Tank is right, those photos of the DMP drag race truck were when it was on a stock rear-end minus Eaton Detroit Locker, (not tru-trac that most others purchase), rear-end cover and gear oil. It was at 820rwhp/930rwtq iirc. Majority of the L scene run about 400rwhp/500rwtq to 700rwhp/800rwtq and have 0 issues even on instant acceleration with slicks at the drag strip. There are some trucks in the 1000+hp mark still running them too.

My friend got a little loose in his L and smacked a curb and it broke off the entire wheel/brake combo at the flange of the axle. So I got to see the axle shaft split in two. It was monstrous looking. I may be able to dig up some photos of that. FFS

 

[The Tank]

I believe the 10.5 rear end in the Super Duties which is also Sterling sourced is the replacement for the Dana 60 when Ford switch bodies in 1999.

 

[FordFanStan]

Here's one pic I got from my buddy:

 

[FordFanStan]

Something I forgot about though is the increased leverage from the extra length of the axle shafts, that may play a part when they are being twisted/flexed? FFS

 

[KaiserM715]

A guy asked me this today, and it kinda stumped me. I mean, I know the general specs:

They both run a 9-3/4" ring gears... both can and do run 4.10:1 gears... I'm pretty sure OEM Dana's came with 32 or 35 spline shafts and the Raptor's rear comes with 34 splines...

When most off-road guys ask this question, they are usually talking about the full float Dana 60. Full float in itself has a lot of advantages over any semi-float axle with the only downside being increased weight. This is a hard question to answer because it depends on axle material / strength, spline count, axle tube thickness / diameter, axle tube to housing weld method (plug vs plug w/ full circumference), gear carrier design, etc. One of the keys for an axle to survive is keeping the pinion gear from deflecting, of which all of the factors above play into. The GM 14 bolt and Ford 9 inch as well as some Toyota axles have an additional pinion support bearing that greatly reduces that deflection (that is why you see 1000+ hp cars running a 9 inch, they would blow up just about anything else...).

I would be willing to put the Raptor's axle up against a factory semi-float Dana 60 any day of the week. The full float, on the other hand, would likely win out depending on configuration. We definitely have one of the best semi floaters out there.

As an aside, the Dana 60 has just about any aftermarket option you can think of and can support gear ratios all the way down to 6.17!!
Here is some info from Randy's Ring and Pinion (an informative site to look around): http://www.ringpinion.com/DiffDetails.aspx?DiffID=20&SearchMode=Diff&TypeID=3