GEN 1 Sprung Under questions

[Hole Shot]

Boarder has said nothing about 4 linking, cantilever, and what do you mean by bed cage? Usually that is a four link setup. What is your definition of a bed cage. I bet you talk to svc or Rpg and they recommend you don't go sprung under.


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[SDHQJASON]

So, I'm considering going to a sprung under setup with Deaver +8 springs. I'll run with regular Fox3.0 for a while, so won't see any benefit for travel numbers. But might see some improvement with preventing axle hop. Who's running Deaver sprung under? Is it stiffer than the Deaver +3 stander over axle setup? Stiffer or softer than stock springs? I've got Deaver +3 currently and they're nice and soft. I don't want to lose that nice rear ride.

Eventually, I'll go with a bedcage or cantilever arrangement for the extra travel and more travel zone tune-ability with a greater number of bypass tubes (bedcage and 3.5 shocks).

I've FRF searched and didn't find any direct info on this. Thanks for any feedback.

A properly designed sprung under kit will net you more wheel travel than your current set-up. When we designed our spring under kit a couple years ago we cycled it with a stock shock in the stock location. With this combination we were cycling 16.5" and you should be close to if not a tiny bit more with the Fox 3.0's you have.

SDHQ Spring Under Kit

Sprung under will cause driveshaft issues due to the way the axle moves. In lower horsepower applications/ranger it works well but in raptors not so much. Unless your going 4 link.


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This has nothing to do with the fact that a Raptor has more horsepower than a Ranger. Driveshaft plunge can be an issue regardless of the vehicle.

 

[FP Forged]

Boarder has said nothing about 4 linking, cantilever, and what do you mean by bed cage? Usually that is a four link setup. What is your definition of a bed cage. I bet you talk to svc or Rpg and they recommend you don't go sprung under.


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I'm assuming he means a bypass cage/rack. Many people call it a bed cage too.

 

[Bigg50]

Boarder has said nothing about 4 linking, cantilever, and what do you mean by bed cage? Usually that is a four link setup. What is your definition of a bed cage. I bet you talk to svc or Rpg and they recommend you don't go sprung under.


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Huh? Only reference to 4link was that the Rogue Raptor was keeping up with a 4linked Raptor.

I don't need to talk to any shops to know if it works. I know it works because the white truck I posted has several thousand miles offroad with a sprung under setup and it performs flawlessly and I've seen it first hand.

This is not the same setup he as he has 2 spares standing vertical. But this is similar to his setup but with sprung under instead of over. Again zero issues

DSC00744 by Expedition X Offroad, on Flickr

Pic of his actual setup

12899727_10154215614107214_701088474_n by Expedition X Offroad, on Flickr

 

[Hole Shot]

A properly designed sprung under kit will net you more wheel travel than your current set-up. When we designed our spring under kit a couple years ago we cycled it with a stock shock in the stock location. With this combination we were cycling 16.5" and you should be close to if not a tiny bit more with the Fox 3.0's you have.

SDHQ Spring Under Kit



This has nothing to do with the fact that a Raptor has more horsepower than a Ranger. Driveshaft plunge can be an issue regardless of the vehicle.

Yes but also the direction the axle moves in a sprung under compared to sprung over is different. Your saying higher Horse power will not increase the amount of driveshaft plunge due to axle wrap??


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[Bigg50]

Yes but also the direction the axle moves in a sprung under compared to sprung over is different. Your saying higher Horse power will not increase the amount of driveshaft plunge due to axle wrap??


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Don't know what to tell ya man...it just works. The truck has seen more dirt than 99% of the Raptors on here ever will and it works so that's about it from me haha.

 

[boarder1995]

Wow - great discussion guys.

Not going 4-link. Might go cantilever or might go bypass/bed mounted cage shocks. Either way, the spring under doesn't care how the longer travel shock arrangement is mounted - shock mounting does nothing to the axle/leaf/pinion path. A cantilever arrangement just allows a linkage to direct axle forces into a shock in a different orientation, with a length of travel reduction for use with standard 3.0 shocks.

Sprung under vs. over DOES affect the pinion angle, but usually for the better during acceleration as it'll prevent the differential from getting cranked up too far. And the same during hard braking, helping prevent differential drop down.

The limits of my driveshaft stroke might be bumped if the spring under can droop lower than a regular set of Deaver +3 I'm currently running. But as the sprung under arrangement already has a greater arch to it, I might be limiting to droop travel with stock shackle limiting travel more versus a slightly flatter over sprung setup.

I was mostly wondering if those with Deaver +8 notice an appreciable harsher ride versus Deaver +3 (if they had those to begin with), since usually a steeper arched spring will be harsher than a flatter spring arrangement. I'll give Deaver a call too for feedback and will report with my findings.

Update after talking with Deaver... They don't call them +8 springs. They're referred to as Deaver sprung under for Raptors. Or something like that. They've had good feedback from customers on them. They do suggest longer rear shackles for droop allowance. Total length of arch is longer to accommodate the slightly steeper rate of arch - it's not just a more bent +3. The times I've talked with Deaver, it's been a good experience. Leaning more towards an eventual install after a bit more investigation. That's all for now.

 

[Hole Shot]

Wow - great discussion guys.

Not going 4-link. Might go cantilever or might go bypass/bed mounted cage shocks. Either way, the spring under doesn't care how the longer travel shock arrangement is mounted - shock mounting does nothing to the axle/leaf/pinion path. A cantilever arrangement just allows a linkage to direct axle forces into a shock in a different orientation, with a length of travel reduction for use with standard 3.0 shocks.

Sprung under vs. over DOES affect the pinion angle, but usually for the better during acceleration as it'll prevent the differential from getting cranked up too far. And the same during hard braking, helping prevent differential drop down.

The limits of my driveshaft stroke might be bumped if the spring under can droop lower than a regular set of Deaver +3 I'm currently running. But as the sprung under arrangement already has a greater arch to it, I might be limiting to droop travel with stock shackle limiting travel more versus a slightly flatter over sprung setup.

I was mostly wondering if those with Deaver +8 notice an appreciable harsher ride versus Deaver +3 (if they had those to begin with), since usually a steeper arched spring will be harsher than a flatter spring arrangement. I'll give Deaver a call too for feedback and will report with my findings.

You also need to make sure your shocks are in the correct travel zone. If not you will be slamming off your bumpstops.

I know jason at tmx was playing with some +5 deavers I dont know what he did or if it worked out.

If sprung over was such a good Idea why wouldnt everyone with a bypass rack be doing it? Why wouldnt svc and rpg sell a kit for more travel? I know there not the only games in town. I'm not saying it cant be done or hasn't but have been told that it is not reccomended due to the highter horspower output of the raptor. Just what I have been told. Good luck, let us know what you come up with.

 

[MTF]

I know I do not need to mention this for most Forum members but for someone new I just want to make it clear with the + numbers.

When it comes to the + numbers, it's not about stiffness or strength.
It's the amount of arch the spring pack has over stock with +2 being stock ride height.

Now you can customize each spring pack regardless of + numbers.
I've chosen to have the top three rebound leafs made of a slightly thicker gauge to help with wheel hop.
And softness/stiffness change was very slight to the a hair stiffer. And the settling is less than a standard + Deavers.

If you do the right spring pack the drive shaft angle shouldn't change. Except for full droop or compression when there is more travel with bigger shocks.

 

[Bigg50]

Wow - great discussion guys.

Not going 4-link. Might go cantilever or might go bypass/bed mounted cage shocks. Either way, the spring under doesn't care how the longer travel shock arrangement is mounted - shock mounting does nothing to the axle/leaf/pinion path. A cantilever arrangement just allows a linkage to direct axle forces into a shock in a different orientation, with a length of travel reduction for use with standard 3.0 shocks.

Sprung under vs. over DOES affect the pinion angle, but usually for the better during acceleration as it'll prevent the differential from getting cranked up too far. And the same during hard braking, helping prevent differential drop down.

The limits of my driveshaft stroke might be bumped if the spring under can droop lower than a regular set of Deaver +3 I'm currently running. But as the sprung under arrangement already has a greater arch to it, I might be limiting to droop travel with stock shackle limiting travel more versus a slightly flatter over sprung setup.

I was mostly wondering if those with Deaver +8 notice an appreciable harsher ride versus Deaver +3 (if they had those to begin with), since usually a steeper arched spring will be harsher than a flatter spring arrangement. I'll give Deaver a call too for feedback and will report with my findings.

Update after talking with Deaver... They don't call them +8 springs. They're referred to as Deaver sprung under for Raptors. Or something like that. They've had good feedback from customers on them. They do suggest longer rear shackles for droop allowance. Total length of arch is longer to accommodate the slightly steeper rate of arch - it's not just a more bent +3. The times I've talked with Deaver, it's been a good experience. Leaning more towards an eventual install after a bit more investigation. That's all for now.

Make sure to use limit straps to prevent the axle from drooping to far. The benefit of sprung under is up-travel which the most limiting factor of the Raptor suspension. Even an extra inch in up-travel makes a huge difference.