Tranmission Finally Got Me

[Ray Knight]

Trade the truck in. Ford warranty (if covered) replaces the transmissions with refurbished parts. I had mine done 3 times and kept breaking. It was never right again once it broke. If you have to pay out of pocket, you may be doing it over and over again. Trade it in for a new one if its still drivable. You will have much less headache and loss.

 

[B E N]

Given that you have a tune, Ford will not warranty your transmission.

This is a blanket statement, and doesn't necessarily apply. The dealer would have to prove within reason the tune caused the issue, they can't simply deny a claim because "you have a tune".

 

[B E N]

Trade the truck in. Ford warranty (if covered) replaces the transmissions with refurbished parts. I had mine done 3 times and kept breaking. It was never right again once it broke. If you have to pay out of pocket, you may be doing it over and over again. Trade it in for a new one if its still drivable. You will have much less headache and loss.

At that point why not just put in a low mile take out? Its easy enough to find a very low mile trans out of a wrecked truck and its almost certainly going to be cheaper than trading in on another raptor.

 

[Deleted member 17706]

This is a blanket statement, and doesn't necessarily apply. The dealer would have to prove within reason the tune caused the issue, they can't simply deny a claim because "you have a tune".

Ford doesn’t have to prove anything. If you are running a tune and you have a powertrain issue, then what do you think is going to get blamed? If it was a cam phaser issue, you may be able to still get it replace anyway because it is a known issue. But given this situation, it is highly unlikely that Ford is going to replace the transmission on their dime (or something like that) with a tune being on the truck. You can’t expect Ford to be culpable for a powertrain issue when you are running a tune.

 

[B E N]

Ford doesn’t have to prove anything.

Yes, in fact they do. Read the magnusson moss act, if a dealer or motor company wants to deny a claim they have to have a reason why and they have to be able to reasonably prove that the thing they are claiming caused the failure did so.

You can’t expect Ford to be culpable for a powertrain issue when you are running a tune.

Do you know what the tune parameters are?

Do you know for a fact that this tune actually changed anything in the transmission logic that would actually cause damage? Do you even know what the optional parameters are and which ones can cause damage?

For that matter do you know what the damage inside the transmission actually is and if its something that could have even been caused by a tune?

Do you know for a fact that the tune itself actually increased the output of the engine beyond the rated power handling capability of the transmission, changed the power enrichment or turbo behavior in such a way to create a torque curve that could be harmful to transmission parts?

Do you know if it changed the boost level at peak torque output, or increased peak torque output? Because if it didn't raise the peak torque value its awfully hard to blame the tune.

Do you know if the tune changed the shift point strategy, clutch engagement logic, line pressures or changed anything that actually could have caused damage to the transmission?

Do you know with certainty that this was a hard parts or wear item failure inside the transmission?

I would love to know what you do, maybe it would change my perspective on the issue. Unless you know any of those items you cannot outright say that the warranty can or even should be denied. For all we know there is an electronic component that simply failed and is completely unrelated to the problems the OP is facing.

Until you can actually justify why " A tune " automatically voids a power train warranty please stop the fear mongering, it hurts the enthusiast, hurts the aftermarket, and hurts the OEM. Thanks.

 

[Ray Knight]

Yes, in fact they do. Read the magnusson moss act, if a dealer or motor company wants to deny a claim they have to have a reason why and they have to be able to reasonably prove that the thing they are claiming caused the failure did so.




Do you know what the tune parameters are?

Do you know for a fact that this tune actually changed anything in the transmission logic that would actually cause damage? Do you even know what the optional parameters are and which ones can cause damage?

For that matter do you know what the damage inside the transmission actually is and if its something that could have even been caused by a tune?

Do you know for a fact that the tune itself actually increased the output of the engine beyond the rated power handling capability of the transmission, changed the power enrichment or turbo behavior in such a way to create a torque curve that could be harmful to transmission parts?

Do you know if it changed the boost level at peak torque output, or increased peak torque output? Because if it didn't raise the peak torque value its awfully hard to blame the tune.

Do you know if the tune changed the shift point strategy, clutch engagement logic, line pressures or changed anything that actually could have caused damage to the transmission?

Do you know with certainty that this was a hard parts or wear item failure inside the transmission?

I would love to know what you do, maybe it would change my perspective on the issue. Unless you know any of those items you cannot outright say that the warranty can or even should be denied. For all we know there is an electronic component that simply failed and is completely unrelated to the problems the OP is facing.

Until you can actually justify why " A tune " automatically voids a power train warranty please stop the fear mongering, it hurts the enthusiast, hurts the aftermarket, and hurts the OEM. Thanks.

I don't know man. I'd think that would be a piece of cake. Tune makes more power. More load on the drivetrain. Probably the easiest thing ever to prove in court.

 

[Deleted member 17706]

Yes, in fact they do. Read the magnusson moss act, if a dealer or motor company wants to deny a claim they have to have a reason why and they have to be able to reasonably prove that the thing they are claiming caused the failure did so.




Do you know what the tune parameters are?

Do you know for a fact that this tune actually changed anything in the transmission logic that would actually cause damage? Do you even know what the optional parameters are and which ones can cause damage?

For that matter do you know what the damage inside the transmission actually is and if its something that could have even been caused by a tune?

Do you know for a fact that the tune itself actually increased the output of the engine beyond the rated power handling capability of the transmission, changed the power enrichment or turbo behavior in such a way to create a torque curve that could be harmful to transmission parts?

Do you know if it changed the boost level at peak torque output, or increased peak torque output? Because if it didn't raise the peak torque value its awfully hard to blame the tune.

Do you know if the tune changed the shift point strategy, clutch engagement logic, line pressures or changed anything that actually could have caused damage to the transmission?

Do you know with certainty that this was a hard parts or wear item failure inside the transmission?

I would love to know what you do, maybe it would change my perspective on the issue. Unless you know any of those items you cannot outright say that the warranty can or even should be denied. For all we know there is an electronic component that simply failed and is completely unrelated to the problems the OP is facing.

Until you can actually justify why " A tune " automatically voids a power train warranty please stop the fear mongering, it hurts the enthusiast, hurts the aftermarket, and hurts the OEM. Thanks.

Will the picture below shut you up? Or do you want to continue rambling on like a Adam Schiff Sophist?

It is common sense. Ford is not going to warranty something powertrain related when the ECU has been changed and the vehicle is running at specs not tested by Ford to insure reliability. It is a simple as that. In fact, hardly no company will warranty a product that has been modified by the consumer to operate in ways/conditions not intended and/or tested by the manufacturer.

The OP has a Cobb Stage 2 tune with downpipes and exhaust according to his signature. He is easily running more HP and TQ than stock, while also changing all the shift points of the truck. How in the world do you think Ford is going to warranty anything that happens to his transmission? The only thing Ford will be proving is that he has a tune! End of story.

Yea, speaking truth contributes to fear mongering and really hurts the enthusiasts. I guess that will be an impeachable offense too.

 

[B E N]

So you know for a fact that there is a catastrophic mechanical failure in the transmission based on the OP's post? Your sure its not a servo, valve body, or electronic failure? The point is you cannot judge whether this should be a warranty issue based on whats been posted by the OP, you don't know whats wrong. For all you know its a poorly assembled connector, which could not have possibly been caused by a tune.

It's obvious you've never seen a tune strategy in one of these, so I won't continue down that path, your ignorance will do nothing but waste my time.

And don't make this political, you have no clue what my leanings are. Nor did I ever post any beliefs about the ethics of making warranty claims on modified vehicles.

 

[Deleted member 17706]

So you know for a fact that there is a catastrophic mechanical failure in the transmission based on the OP's post? Your sure its not a servo, valve body, or electronic failure? The point is you cannot judge whether this should be a warranty issue based on whats been posted by the OP, you don't know whats wrong. For all you know its a poorly assembled connector, which could not have possibly been caused by a tune.

It's obvious you've never seen a tune strategy in one of these, so I won't continue down that path, your ignorance will do nothing but waste my time.

And don't make this political, you have no clue what my leanings are. Nor did I ever post any beliefs about the ethics of making warranty claims on modified vehicles.

If it is something minor Ford may decide to replace it. But again, if Ford runs a scan on the vehicle and sees the ECU has been changed, then that is enough for them to deny liability for whatever the problem is regardless of whether it is minor or not. If it is a known problem that Ford is liable for, say cam phasers, then Ford will likely replace it. As you pointed out, there are some things that may not be effected (if at all) by a tune. And hopefully for the sake of the OP, it is one of those things. But as the Ford tech stated, when the customer changes the original calibrations of the powertrain, all bets are off. It doesn’t matter how similar the tune strategy is to stock, it is not stock!

Recently, there has been several guys on the forum that have had suspension components denied for warranty work because they have aftermarket suspension components. In some cases, it didn’t seem warranted for Ford to do such a thing. But there is not much you can do when Ford denies it. And no, Ford doesn’t have prove anything besides the fact that you have an aftermarket part that caused a related OEM component to fail. Good luck arguing that in court.

I never said what your political leanings were. I simply made a comparison between how you were acting and Adam Schiff given your waxing eloquence of “fear mongering” and “hurting the real enthusiasts” when I simply stated a fact—that’s not the same as saying you are a democrat. Moreover, you attack my credibility as not being knowledgeable on the subject—that’s another great sophist move to deflect from the subject at hand (ad hominem rhetoric).

Yes, my original statement was short and did not fully express all the intricacies of what we have discussed. So if you want to knock me for that, then fine. But that doesn’t change the fact that when one runs a tune, Ford is no longer liable for one’s powertrain components. It is common sense.

 

[B E N]

Wow man, really impressed by you, especially your Latin and your total inability to treat people with any dignity whatsoever, your ability to argue by attacking people and talking down to them. The good news is I don't have to argue with someone who wants nothing but treat strangers like shit, and has no interest in actually coming to a conclusion, so you win! Welcome to ignore.

For the future readers of this thread, please take the time to understand your rights, specifically as they pertain to the installation of aftermarket parts, tunes etc. And what legal actions you have available in the case of a claim denial. Please don't assume outright that "a tune" absolves Ford from any and all drive train related warranty responsibilities as has been inferred by this thread. There is a pretty good review of this exact topic from an enthusiasts point of view here:
https://www.roadandtrack.com/car-cu...ll-aftermarket-parts-will-void-your-warranty/

Make your own judgements.

To the OP, sorry this got so far off track, hopefully you can get some quality input.