Prospective Buyer - need some advice

[Jwod1993]

Hi All,

Hoping to be joining the Raptor club soon. Needing to buy a new truck before winter hits here in the northeast. I've been lurking in forums and Facebook groups to learn as much about these trucks as I can before purchasing. I'm leaning towards a used 2020 mainly due to the live Fox shocks as well as the supposedly less common cam phaser issues with this model year. I've read somewhere that the cam phasers were updated on Raptors that were built post 11/2019. Is this true? Should I narrow my search to look for trucks built after Nov 2019?

Thanks in advance, looking forward to being in one soon.

Jake

 

[2020FordRaptor]

Hi All,

Hoping to be joining the Raptor club soon. Needing to buy a new truck before winter hits here in the northeast. I've been lurking in forums and Facebook groups to learn as much about these trucks as I can before purchasing. I'm leaning towards a used 2020 mainly due to the live Fox shocks as well as the supposedly less common cam phaser issues with this model year. I've read somewhere that the cam phasers were updated on Raptors that were built post 11/2019. Is this true? Should I narrow my search to look for trucks built after Nov 2019?

Thanks in advance, looking forward to being in one soon.

Jake

I wouldn't know on the Cam Phasers but maybe @FordTechOne knows. I agree with you on choosing a 2019/20 as I love the Live Valve function. I'll tell you that you won't be disappointed when you buy a honest Raptor. Here's my list on what to look for when buying a used Raptor:

Exam skid plates for dents or cracks, exam suspension system for any cracks, exam engine bay for any excessive dust, check exhaust tips for scratches, and plain ask if it was an off-roaded. Definitely have a dealer lift it to check it out the underbody. Rock back and forth all around the car to look for any "waving" from dents or scratches. Hope this helps!

 

[FordTechOne]

Yes, the new phaser part number went into production in 11/2019. However, I wouldn’t hesitate to buy an earlier build, as long as recall 21B10 was completed prior to 2/29/2022 (to qualify for extended coverage) and no cold start rattle is present. The new calibration in 21B10 prevents the issue from developing.

 

[Jwod1993]

Yes, the new phaser part number went into production in 11/2019. However, I wouldn’t hesitate to buy an earlier build, as long as recall 21B10 was completed prior to 2/29/2022 (to qualify for extended coverage) and no cold start rattle is present. The new calibration in 21B10 prevents the issue from developing.

Thank you this is very helpful!

 

[Jwod1993]

Yes, the new phaser part number went into production in 11/2019. However, I wouldn’t hesitate to buy an earlier build, as long as recall 21B10 was completed prior to 2/29/2022 (to qualify for extended coverage) and no cold start rattle is present. The new calibration in 21B10 prevents the issue from developing.

@FordTechOne is 21N08 related to 21B10? What's the difference? If you don't mind explaining. They both look like a reflash of the PCM

 

[FordTechOne]

@FordTechOne is 21N08 related to 21B10? What's the difference? If you don't mind explaining. They both look like a reflash of the PCM

21N08 is simply extended coverage for engines that experience an issue after 21B10. On a well maintained truck 21N08 should never need to be done and should remain “open” until it expires.

 

[Donovan]

Someone explain to my why the new Fox shocks are better than the older Gen 2 shocks.

 

[smurfslayer]

Welcome to FRF.

Ford has an extended coverage plan on cam phasers for Raptors prior to ’19 when they swapped to the latest revision. Most trucks never had the problem. I remember the latest revision was brought into production in ’19, but if the truck hasn’t been seen for it and has the coverage, you should be good.

You need a cold soak start up to rule this concern in or out. this means not running for at least 12 hours. use a laser thermometer to ensure that is the case. The reflash will help prevent the onset of the issue.

 

[duff49]

21N08 is simply extended coverage for engines that experience an issue after 21B10. On a well maintained truck 21N08 should never need to be done and should remain “open” until it expires.

I don’t know if I completely agree with this. I’m open to having my mind changed, but the way I see it is they found that programming was causing the old style phasers to have issues. They give a recall/TSB to revise programming which ultimately messed with oil pressure. Higher/lower oil pressure undoubtedly causes misfires and some trucks to stutter. I feel like this was there hope to not have to install a bunch of the new designed phasers to appease the owners. So if the truck does start to make noise or in fact the new programming causes a stutter they revert back and then replace to updated phasers. So the updated phasers can apparently live happily under the original programming. Why not just install the new updated phasers to begin with….because it saves a whole bunch of money by hopefully placing a bandaid reprogramming that gets the vehicle past the mileage of warranty. Just my current opinion and maybe I’m way off.

 

[FordTechOne]

I don’t know if I completely agree with this. I’m open to having my kind changed, but the way I see it is they found that programming was causing the old style phasers to have issues. They give a recall/TSB to revise programming which ultimately messed with oil pressure. Higher/lower oil pressure undoubtedly cause misfires and some truck to stutter. I feel like this was there hope to not have to install a bunch of the new designed phasers to appease the owners. So if the truck does start to make noise or in fact the new programming causes a stutter they revert back and then replace to updated phasers. So the updated phasers can apparently live happily under the original programming. Why not just install the new updated phasers to begin with….because it saves a whole bunch of money of the bandaid reprogramming gets the vehicle past the mileage of warranty. Just my current opinion and maybe I’m way off.

That theory is not correct. The issue addressed in 21N08 will occur regardless of which phaser is installed and has nothing to do with the phaser itself. The issue only affects trucks that were poorly maintained and/or ran low on oil, which causes cam journal wear/scoring. The new calibration in 21B10 changes the phaser duty cycle; this can be seen by comparing the VCT PIDs. The increase in duty cycle requires additional oil flow to the phaser. When cam journal wear is present, the oil bleeds off before it reaches the phaser. The lower volume of oil causes erratic VCT operation, which is then experienced as a shudder under certain driving conditions.

Neither program will fix a phaser that is already exhibiting a rattle. If a rattle is present before 21B10 is performed, the phasers require replacement per the TSB or 21N03. 21N08 has nothing to do with the actual root cause and should not be performed.