O2 & Unknown troublecode

[1FastSUV]

I recently purchased a 14 with the twin turbo Hellion kit. For the most part it runs great and I love the truck.

Every so often when I'm cruising around 2k rpms the truck will start to sputter and lose power like it's gasping for air. If I give it gas it accelerates and the problem seems to go away. Every once in a while it will lose power and backfire. 95% of the time it runs fine and I don't have any problems, but every once in a while it gives me those problems.

I checked the trouble codes and got "P2197 O2 Sensor Signal Stuck Lean - Bank 2, Sensor 1" and ""P193C Unknown."

Has anyone had this problem, and is it just a bad O2 sensor, or am I looking at a tuning issue? The Hellion Kit and tune were already installed when i purchased the truck.

Thanks in advance

---------- Post added at 10:42 AM ---------- Previous post was at 10:41 AM ----------

I forgot to mention I have an appointment at the dealership but I don't know if they'll touch it due to the aftermarket stuff and tune.

 

[Riddick]

Why don’t you call Hellion and visit with them? I don’t see but one or two running that setup on here so we can only speculate what the problem is. @MTF is the master of power adders and may have an answer.

 

[MTF]

This is pretty good reading:
http://www.diagnostictrouble.com/obdii-code/p193c

This one comes close: https://www.obd-codes.com/p0193

You may want to look into the Fuse 27 deal, at least check it!
There are several threads on Fuse 27 (fuel pump)

The code P2187 seems to be tied into the P193c:
https://www.autocodes.com/p2197_ford.html

It could be the O2 wire harness is damaged.
And/or the connection to the fuel rail sensor is bad too, or it's faulty.

It is known that they never were able to get the Tune quite right.
I would call them. Sorry that is all I have on the subject.
Good Luck.

 

[1FastSUV]

This is pretty good reading:
P193C Diagnostic Code And P193C OBD-II Code Look-Up | DiagnosticTrouble.com

This one comes close: https://www.obd-codes.com/p0193

You may want to look into the Fuse 27 deal, at least check it!
There are several threads on Fuse 27 (fuel pump)

The code P2187 seems to be tied into the P193c:
https://www.autocodes.com/p2197_ford.html

It could be the O2 wire harness is damaged.
And/or the connection to the fuel rail sensor is bad too, or it's faulty.

It is known that they never were able to get the Tune quite right.
I would call them. Sorry that is all I have on the subject.
Good Luck.

Thanks for all the info. I'll get to reading and making phone calls today. We went to the Cleveland car show this weekend (2hr drive on highways) and it caused me problems on the way up there but not on the way back. It ran great on the way back, and even had a new Mustang trying to race me on the turnpike.

I spoke to Hellion when I first got it and they basically dumped it on the tuner. They told me they just supply the hardware and the installers and tuners take it from there. hmm

---------- Post added at 08:55 AM ---------- Previous post was at 08:52 AM ----------

Update from the dealer. They said that since it had headers and no cats they thought the computer was causing the problem thinking there were cats. Since it had a tune they couldn't do anything else with it. I thanked them for trying and left.

 

[MTF]

Yeah, if the dealer doesn't have a gear head racing tech in their shop you will not get any help.
I was fortunate when doing my Whipple, I found a dealer with a SVT Tech that was into Supercharged Mustangs. He knew all about this stuff!!!
You may want to call other dealers close to you and ask, couldn't hurt.

Anyway, do you have the Handheld Tuner/Scanner?
I don't know off hand what Hellions Tuner uses.

Did they give a phone number to contact the Tuner?
I only trying to help here the best I can.
I'm sure the Tuner turned off the rear O2s you can check with the scanner you used to pull the codes.
It should say incomplete in two of the lines when you run a check with a scanner.
If it does then there off.

I searched some Tuner shops in your area:
Ford Truck Tuning | Smokey's Dyno
and
RDP Motorsport Vehicle ECU Tuning

They both deal with the handheld SCT Tuner/Scanner, maybe give them a call and pick their brain as to what your options may be.
At least if you can contact the original Tuner you could do a remote Tuning session at one of these Dyno shops.

Just a thought.

My other suggestion would be to call Livernois and drive the 5 to 6 hours and drop it off to them to fix it.
They have twin turbo setups, not Hellions kit but their own.
They also sell the upgraded Fuel Pump if the stock fuel pump cannot keep up.
I'm running it, I don't really need it for the power I'm running at the moment, BUT you never know what the future brings to my baby.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GhZGG82kqbc
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xFVrVptvufg

If I were you that's what I would do.

As a side note: pay attention to the gas stations you use! I see a difference between them.
I'm assuming you filled up in Cleveland to drive back home, right?
I get the best results using 93 octane from BP and not just any BP there are some that maybe shady if you get my meaning.

 

[1FastSUV]

Yeah, if the dealer doesn't have a gear head racing tech in their shop you will not get any help.
I was fortunate when doing my Whipple, I found a dealer with a SVT Tech that was into Supercharged Mustangs. He knew all about this stuff!!!
You may want to call other dealers close to you and ask, couldn't hurt.

Anyway, do you have the Handheld Tuner/Scanner?
I don't know off hand what Hellions Tuner uses.

Did they give a phone number to contact the Tuner?
I only trying to help here the best I can.
I'm sure the Tuner turned off the rear O2s you can check with the scanner you used to pull the codes.
It should say incomplete in two of the lines when you run a check with a scanner.
If it does then there off.

I searched some Tuner shops in your area:
Ford Truck Tuning | Smokey's Dyno
and
RDP Motorsport Vehicle ECU Tuning

They both deal with the handheld SCT Tuner/Scanner, maybe give them a call and pick their brain as to what your options may be.
At least if you can contact the original Tuner you could do a remote Tuning session at one of these Dyno shops.

Just a thought.

My other suggestion would be to call Livernois and drive the 5 to 6 hours and drop it off to them to fix it.
They have twin turbo setups, not Hellions kit but their own.
They also sell the upgraded Fuel Pump if the stock fuel pump cannot keep up.
I'm running it, I don't really need it for the power I'm running at the moment, BUT you never know what the future brings to my baby.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GhZGG82kqbc
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xFVrVptvufg

If I were you that's what I would do.

As a side note: pay attention to the gas stations you use! I see a difference between them.
I'm assuming you filled up in Cleveland to drive back home, right?
I get the best results using 93 octane from BP and not just any BP there are some that maybe shady if you get my meaning.

I really appreciate all the help. I also have a SRT8 jeep that's running a turbo and fully built motor. Smokey's who did the initial work, but they're now out of business. (understandably so ;-) ) RDP did the tuning in my SRT after I upgraded the turbo. There's also a DNY Performance that is getting good reviews on the SRT forums.

I really like your idea about making the trip to Livernois. I'd like to get it in where someone has some experience with the twins. I originally contacted Hellion and they gave me info to contact a Chris at BlowByRacing. I've emailed him twice and haven't gotten any response. I'm thinking I need to trade it in and get smartcar. :-(

I've been using 93 Octane but I haven't been picky about where I get it. I'm gonna take your advice and be selective from now on. With the huge tank I should have plenty of time to get a good station.

The strangest part about my problem is that it's so intermittent. I had an hour drive up the highway yesterday and didn't have any problems on the way up or the on the way back home. It only happens every once in a while but it really runs rough when it happens. Once I stomp on the throttle it completely goes away till I get back to 2k rpm cruising speed. Really strange!

I'm hoping it's just a vacuum leak but with my luck i'll probably need a whole new engine. Luckily it only has 18,000 miles on it, so hopefully it isn't broken too bad .............yet.

Sorry I forgot mention the tuner. I have a couple different ones. An old Predator, a Trinity and one of the new InTunes. I also have a laptop with HP Tuners on it but I don't know how to do any of the tuning. They were mainly used for my jeep but I can try them on the truck and see what they say.

Thanks again for the help!

 

[MTF]

The problem is the calibration strategy Ford designed for the Raptor's PCM never considered Twin Turbos.
As far as the 6.2L is concerned.
I hope you can get it straighten out. Good Luck

 

[1FastSUV]

Thanks again for all your help.

I had a local gearhead check it out. He has a sweet new scanner that looks like a tablet. He ran the scans as he drove and he said the O2 sensor was stuck. He said it's supposed to read between 13.5 and 15 (I don't remember the exact range) and it was reading flat at 20-something. (It was Fri night and I was on my way to a poker game so I didn't pay attention to the exact numbers he rattled off)

He replaced the O2 sensor but I haven't had a chance to get out on the highway and see if it solved my problem. It's always driven fine around town at slower speeds. The problem always occurred on the highway cruising around 65-70 around 2,000 rpms. I'm gonna take it for a spin after work today and see if the problem is solved.

His scanner also found my other trouble code was the steering angle sensor. He said my backup camera lines are supposed to turn as I turn but mine stay straight. I've never had a backup camera so I never realized it wasn't working right. lol My SRT doesn't have all that fancy stuff so I was just happy to have a backup camera.

Thanks again for the advice! I'll keep you posted on if the problem is solved.

 

[ogdobber]

Thanks again for all your help.



I had a local gearhead check it out. He has a sweet new scanner that looks like a tablet. He ran the scans as he drove and he said the O2 sensor was stuck. He said it's supposed to read between 13.5 and 15 (I don't remember the exact range) and it was reading flat at 20-something. (It was Fri night and I was on my way to a poker game so I didn't pay attention to the exact numbers he rattled off)



He replaced the O2 sensor but I haven't had a chance to get out on the highway and see if it solved my problem. It's always driven fine around town at slower speeds. The problem always occurred on the highway cruising around 65-70 around 2,000 rpms. I'm gonna take it for a spin after work today and see if the problem is solved.



His scanner also found my other trouble code was the steering angle sensor. He said my backup camera lines are supposed to turn as I turn but mine stay straight. I've never had a backup camera so I never realized it wasn't working right. lol My SRT doesn't have all that fancy stuff so I was just happy to have a backup camera.



Thanks again for the advice! I'll keep you posted on if the problem is solved.

The original code in op told you had a stuck o2 sensor. I don't understand why you just didn't fix it then?
Also the backup camera lines that turn can be turned on or off. I find them annoying, so i have mine straight.
You can enable them in sync


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

 

[1FastSUV]

The original code in op told you had a stuck o2 sensor. I don't understand why you just didn't fix it then?
Also the backup camera lines that turn can be turned on or off. I find them annoying, so i have mine straight.
You can enable them in sync


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

I did have it checked at the dealership and was told that since I had a custom tune, headers and cats deleted they weren't sure if the O2 sensor was really the issue. They said their scanner wouldn't let them go into any further diagnostics.

In addition the info from MTF suggested the two codes could be related, or that it could be some type of vacuum leak, fuel rail sensor or fuse #27.

"The code P2187 seems to be tied into the P193c:
https://www.autocodes.com/p2197_ford.html"

I couldn't see spending the $100 + labor to replace the O2 sensor if nobody could tell if that was truly an issue or not, but thanks for the advice.