GEN 2 Tune 2017 ford raptor - yes!!

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WRCRaptor

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87 is supported and was mentioned by ford during PR. You will never drop HP on a turbo vehicle when its under boost from decreased exhaust back pressure.
I run 87 in the 6.2 with no issues and even with a tune. Only run 93 when I am taking the truck to play

87 works for the Gen1 but for me there was an issue with rough idle and it was worse in below 30deg temps.

As for the Turbo engine we could argue all day about the topic but if the ECU compensates for different octane levels by lets say adjusting the timing to make up for a different burn rate of 87 vs. 91 then you will lose HP and maybe a fraction of boost pressure. Maybe only a tiny bit and not noticeable on the butt dyno but what is the longterm effect on the engine.

I am not starting a debate here just pointing a few things to think about. I would run 91 or better in my Turbo vehicle.
 

SilentShooter

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87 works for the Gen1 but for me there was an issue with rough idle and it was worse in below 30deg temps.

As for the Turbo engine we could argue all day about the topic but if the ECU compensates for different octane levels by lets say adjusting the timing to make up for a different burn rate of 87 vs. 91 then you will lose HP and maybe a fraction of boost pressure. Maybe only a tiny bit and not noticeable on the butt dyno but what is the longterm effect on the engine.

I am not starting a debate here just pointing a few things to think about. I would run 91 or better in my Turbo vehicle.

I was not talking about octane changes I was referencing your mention of exhaust can drop power numbers. on a NA yes, but on a turbo when making boost it will never drop from decreased back pressure. Lower octane on a Boosted car will drop HP as the engine pulls timing but if you are driving on the highway for a road trip you really don't need all 450hp to cruise at 80mph and with the cost difference now between 87 and 93 near me unless I got 25% better MPG with 93 its cheaper to run 87 and only 93 when I want max performance.

Zero difference on the actual motor between 87, 89, 93 if its designed to run with those octanes. But yes running 97 in a vehicle set for 91+ can lead to issues. even small amounts of knocking (detonation) can lead to wear or failure but if your vehicle is designed for 87 that should not be an issue. Just don't run bad gas.. :biggrin:
 

WRCRaptor

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Got it! Yes exhaust mods result in gains most of the time on Turbos. CAI sometimes don't make better HP I has one car that it actually lost power and we could not adjust the tune to make it work and it was from a very well known parts supplier for Subarus that had some great HP increase numbers for it.

I will not take a lot of chances on a new vehicle until things are vetted out I have been the test subject one to many times
 

max_Raptor

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Looking forward to the FP tune as the dealers here will be forced to acknowledge it and it will sell like hot cakes if offered.

Regarding the Octane/CAI/Exhaust debate I have had my share of experience with turbo charged cars, most recently 7 years with a Nissan GTR that I sold earlier this year.

Firstly the CAI, here it depends on if the ECU uses a MAF (Mass Air Flow) based approach or a speed density based approach. For Speed Density changing the intake pipe size will have no negative effect, it actually help the turbo built boost, commonly referred to as spool, in earlier in the RPM curve. However, when it comes to a MAF based approach changes to the pipe size will have a drastic effect on the tune as the MAF sensor has a fixed equation that is dependent on the pipe size and the location of the MAF in the air stream. Where increasing the pipe size/MAF location will require a tune. A better flowing CAI with similar pipe sizing and MAF location will help the turbo spool faster.

When it comes to the 2017 Ford Raptor I actually have no idea what kind of approach it has, we need the help of someone who actually has one

Second discussion is the exhaust. A turbo engine will always benefit from a larger exhaust. I tested 76mm, 90mm and 102mm exhaust systems and I always had a better dyno curve in terms of spool before even extracting the maximum with a tune. The maximum power will be found when replacing the downpipes of a turbo car as it has the biggest effect on backpressure on the turbine side of the turbo. When going to a cat-less system or when changing the location of the O2 sensor it is recommended to tune the car as the ECU will try to compensate and could pull power but definitely it will throw a CEL.

Finally, the Octane rating of the fuel used. Commonly it is known that the higher octane rating the higher knock/detonation resistance your combustion process has. There is one aspect that many people don’t understand especially on turbo charged cars. Intake air temperatures before the combustion chamber are always higher than ambient due to the fact that as you compress air its temperature increases, the intercooler aids in the lowering of said temperature but relatively it is higher than ambient. The mixture of low octane fuel and high IAT (Intake Air Temperature) produces detonation/knock, especially on tuned cars. Due to the varying ambient temperature across the US a guy living up north using 87 octane fuel may not experience detonation/knock while a guy down south may experience detonation/knock which will cause the ECU to pull timing lowering the engine power.

If you live in hot climate and plan on driving your DD Raptor aggressively over the weekend making the small investment of putting in a higher octane fuel than you usually do will ensure an enjoyable drive and a healthier engine

Sorry for the long post, just wanted to make a couple of things clear
 

Wilson

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I can tell you that unless Ford says you can run lower then 91 don't do it. I know the Gen1 is a different animal, the owners manual says you can run 87 and the 6.2 would lose about 10hp. 10hp so what you can't feel that loss, but what I noticed is that the truck (bone stock) did not idle smoothly on 87 so after 4 tanks of 87 to see if the truck would learn to like the 87 it did not. Also the gas milage is a little better on 91 or better but it was not enough to make a good case for just that. What sold me on the higher octane was the smoother running engine.

I have owned lots of Turbo cars and what I can say is they just run better on higher octane gas. Do what you want but I would run 91 or better in a Gen2 after all it is considered a performance truck.

Adding a CAI and muffler may not make much of a difference on the Gen2 without a tune. It may even run worse but who knows until someone gives it a shot.

yes but 25% worse gas mileage :ROFLJest:

I was not talking about octane changes I was referencing your mention of exhaust can drop power numbers. on a NA yes, but on a turbo when making boost it will never drop from decreased back pressure. Lower octane on a Boosted car will drop HP as the engine pulls timing but if you are driving on the highway for a road trip you really don't need all 450hp to cruise at 80mph and with the cost difference now between 87 and 93 near me unless I got 25% better MPG with 93 its cheaper to run 87 and only 93 when I want max performance.

Zero difference on the actual motor between 87, 89, 93 if its designed to run with those octanes. But yes running 97 in a vehicle set for 91+ can lead to issues. even small amounts of knocking (detonation) can lead to wear or failure but if your vehicle is designed for 87 that should not be an issue. Just don't run bad gas.. :biggrin:

e-30 is about 95 octane .10 cent's cheaper than 87 octane and I get the same or better mpg with it. also a crisper running engine. you guy's (not necessarily quoted) can live in denial if you want I use it and it work's for me.
 

17Jake

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:flipthebird: ethanol > 0.2% market share
Ethanol's low heat value makes it more difficult to crank engines in cold weather.
#Ultra94
 
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yenrod

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All I can say is the vehicle manufacturer puts on the vehicle sticker:gas cap what the recommended octane is to run that vehicle/engine. Anything else could have less/more than desired results for the engine without accompanied re-mapping adjustments. Opinions vary, but that be mine


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WRCRaptor

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All I can say is the vehicle manufacturer puts on the vehicle sticker:gas cap what the recommended octane is to run that vehicle/engine. Anything else could have less/more than desired results for the engine without accompanied re-mapping adjustments. Opinions vary, but that be mine


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True almost all of the time if all gas was the same. I have had some vehicles that respond to higher octane then the MFG recommended. The Gen1 runs on 87 but the owners manual states that on 87 it is 401hp and on 91 it is 411, can I feel that difference no but my truck runs smother. The manual also says slight knocking is not an issue!

People will find what works for them in there geographic area and there are differences from brand to brand. I don't like Sunoco anymore they changed their formula a while back and our old TR-6 (carbureted) runs like crap on it. For the most part I look for top tier gasoline provider and have good luck with that.

As for @Wilson and the E30 stuff I don't know, it is not common here in MI. although I have not look very hard to find it.
 
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